I only ever watched the first Saw so I'm afraid I didn't catch the reference. Ah well. The movie was definitely a bit Hollywood but not horribly bad. Portions of it were kinda bad... like the suitcase thing. They kind of imply the whole thing was planned, but that doesn't make any sense. I think the writer got too caught up in being clever and kinda lost track of continuity. Ah well, it was still decent. I love how 47 just has no problem shooting people.

Have you seen Equilibrium then?

http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0238380/

This impressed me much more from the side of acrobatic shooting.

Equilibrium was allright actually

On the thing about having seen only the original SAW, save yourself the effort and don't bother with the remaining 3. They all suck. At least on comparison to the first.

Heh... I tought actually Saw II was the best. I really loved watching det. Matthews trash and crush Jigsaw and listen to Jigsaw boring/irritating/provoking him to death beforemath. Besides, having more people being supposed to "play" together brings a live to the atmosphere.

Saw III and IV disappointed me, kinda. There was even nudity in the third part. The first part was rather boring. But all are still enough interesting to make me watch them from time to time.

And now I see a disambiguation:


I spoke about Equilibrium. It is definitely a should-see.

Yes, I really like Equilibrium. The gun-kata is awesome.

See I preferred SAW one because it really put you in the minds of the people involved - you were trying to figure out how they would escape much like a room in Broken Sword or Fahrenheit, or any other great puzzle adventure game. You felt like you were trying to help them as they figured stuff out.

In the later films, it became more about watching people put themselves through pain to free themselves, rather than also figuring out stuff.

Not I, not really sir. No sorry. (I just watched it and did analyze and comparisons in a separate thread) It was you, and probably some other people.


In Saw II people are as well not put on immediate pain by default (they put themselves or others in pain for their own stupidity or whatever). Don't forget only one person died because of the nerve gas. So, I'd tell that just like in Saw, people in Saw II had limited time to make their way out. It is as well not to wonder that within 93 minutes (duration of Saw II) you don't have time to get to know seven totally new people as good as you could just two within 102 minutes (duration of Saw).

But more to the point, it's not all about the pain only. There's a story as well. (And not only this what follows, but this is what I liked:) Jigsaw slowly crawling into det. Matthews' person, mining it, seeding there all feelings needed to make him lose control, release his demons and set him on a hysteric rampage. Man, that's a masterpiece of psychology drama (kinda). No other part of Saw series has such a thing.

Besides, more people (mentioned above) means more traps. I like these traps. For each of them I like to consider how would the one build it with his ten fingers and, of course, enough resources provided. How would one choose to buy the needed parts without getting suspicious. Eh? That's an aspect of whole Saw series that I really like. You probably don't bother.


Right that too I could say for Saw II. Basically, the problem is the same: people are trapped and have limited set of provided means to release themselves. BUT notice this: while Lawrence needs to kill or saw his leg off or die (more less the same can be said for Adam), all people in Saw II have chance for salvation - but, they're picture of human nature, which brings most of them to deaths.

And in the end, what I liked in the Saw II is the smell... it's like I could feel smell of that house, shape of its every edge, most of thoughts that the people involved would've possibly had (if it were real). Do you know which part made the strongest impression to me in Saw? The part where Lawrence saws his leg off. So, Saw II doesn't have such culminations, but it has at least two others that are pretty close to that one + all stuff I mentioned above. Enough for me to call it my favorite, dude.

Lol, when I say 'you' in that phrase, I wasn't referring directly to you In some extent, I agree with what you say. But I didn't feel anything for any of the characters in SAW II. Why? Because even the main character was going through an 'it's all been done before' kind of situation. It was nothing new, despite it being satisfying to see him batter Jigsaw.

All the characters in the house weren't important to me. I wanted to see SAW II to find out what happened to the dude left in the bathroom (which did eventually become evident) I wanted it to be a direct continuation. Unfortunately for me, the writers obviously wanted to appeal to a wider market and (logically) went for a new film which was tied in to the others. I however thought that it was to far from the original style.

In SAW II, if a character died, it became about how they died - which manner of trap will they get themselves in to? That's not what the first SAW was for me. The first SAW to me was the Psychology of it. The characters train of thought was the biggest part of the film. Now it's just second place. I prefer the original recipe is all.

And the twist in the first film was much better than any in the latter.

As far as the traps go, there were a few that I liked. I enjoyed the first head peice (SAW 1) the needle Pit (Saw 2) just because it really put the 'ouch' factor on, the Hand trap (Saw 2) because the retard could have gotten out if they'd be smart, the Pig Vat (SAW III) and last but not least, not really a trap but the opening sequence of SAW IV was awesome.

Oh, I see. Got it.

Actually it seems to be the matter of the first impression. Saw II is the first movie I watched and, after it, Saw just (I told it already) was boring me the most of time.

In the previous post I missed to notice (my opinion follows): in the Saw, the breaking moment is when Lawrence decides to saw his leg off, in Saw II it was when det. Matthews decides to take the situation in his hands. There was a difference: Lawrence turned out to be the victim of the psychological pressure created by himself rather. Matthews' breakdown was planned intentionally and systematically and he was even warned.

So, I am centering det. Matthews as a point everything goes around in the Saw II. But an important detail is that the one who watches doesn't know that before the end.

Nah... I don't care. Much things has been said, the point remained unsaid: Probably neither of us will change his favorite (which is not bad thing at all). Still I can say IMDB mark is on the side of Saw for now. And its successors tend to have lower and lower marks.

The trap that really put the groove effect on was the quadruple shotgun. Believe me or not, I WAS wondering why Jigsaw, escaping, haven't taken the straight route, before I knew there's a big bang coming. If I remember well, there was even spider web there. Really stupid move by the officer Sing.

Btw, Mole, do you think Lawrence could have catched that cellphone if he kept being sane?


Actually I read somewhere it was possible to unlock this glass cage from its other side. But Addison just dropped the tape (she hadn't anything to play it with). By the story, this trap was intended for impulsive Gus, who got himself killed just in the beginning for the same thing that had to be tested with this hand trap.

I also read that it could be opened from the other side - so I youtubed for a clip of it, and I could not see any lock and key attached. However, if the person (Addison?) had have put there hand in one hole, as she did at the start, she could technically open the spikes with the other hand using her fingers and slide her arm out free. Also, it was an antidote in the trap was it not? (not a tape).

I don't understand that cellphone comment.

Bah, they are all stupid anatomy films. Imo one of the coolest movie openings is the "Ghost Ship" where they use a metal wire. That was so disgusting and yet brilliant.

Tape was attached to the box (outside) in an envelope but Addison just threw it off. In the box was a needle of course. And yeah that for one hand's right. But even if she got both hands there in, if she hadn't wasted the injection, she could've pressed the needle hard with one of the hands, injecting herself. Then she would have to wait for someone to find and free her, which is a bad perspective from the point that nobody except Jigsaw and his apprentice knew she's there. But then again, she'd survive the nerve gas.

As for the lock, dunno lemme lookup for the text... (found in Wikipedia). You know, the key may be pretty small, since it was intended for Gus. I think it would be unnecessary to mention his impatient and impulsive personality again.

And that for Lawrence. Do you remember: Lawrence lost his sanity in the moment he couldn't reach the cellphone ringing. This cellphone flew away as he got electrical shock. What I meant is: don't you think he could've reached that cellphone somehow, with or without Adam's help? I vote for yes.

Actually, I think there's a way to free yourself once both your hands are in the hand trap. Crawl one hand further inside the box (that direction isn't forbidden), and rotate it simultaneously, so that in the end it be able of releasing the other hand from razor blades from inside. Skin is still very flexible so it wouldn't cause much harm rotating the hand slightly once elbow has entered. The move is just doable: Imagine your hands there in and you will even realize it would be a pretty natural move, from the point of anatomy. Once you get one hand free, you'd figure out how to get out.

Yet, to be sure this works, you'd have to be trapped there in.

p.s.
This smile below is the best John's face in the whole serial.

Got bored from the topic Mole?

Heh, okay, then just a conclusion: most of these traps IMHO could've been cheated if the characters in the movie took the situation with reason and caution (do you guess how?). Their mistakes are what makes the most of Saw > 1 movies (there where the victim has a choice of course). For example, if I seen a model of that hand trap to be sure, I would dare even putting my both hands in and demonstrate its cracking for a certain amount of money. However... with a "fake" hand-trap provided (like that one from the movie), the demonstration would be for free.